dallashistory

Edit; Thanks to many posters at this site, a great thread with personal info about Jimmy has developed. The title is "Shanghai Jimmy" and it is in this Dallas Living section.

I would rather not use that thread for the search, and speculation, about Jimmy's recipe and serving techniques. Lets do that here.

Jimmy served up his great Chili Rice in Dallas, at the State Fair and several locations, for many years. Clyde brought up Jimmy on the Tex Mex thread. I was already thinking about starting a thread.

We have been discussing the search for Jimmy's Chili Rice chili recipe, and this site, at Roadfood.com. The number of us who have tasted Jimmy's chili is getting smaller and smaller. There is no time to waste!
Joe

Joe beat you to the punch see my post with the links to various Google searches

Joe, here (for others' benefit who had not seen the thread) is the post from Homer Burks as he transcribed the recipe from an old record:

Shanghai Jimmy’s Texas Chili
For use in Chili Rice

Ingredients:

2 lbs. beef – lean chili cut (I have found that a nice lean roast ground into chili meat works best)
6 beef bullion cubes
1 bay leaf
2 tablespoons cooking oil
4 teaspoons sugar
1 teaspoon salt
½ teaspoon red pepper (this is his recipe. You might adjust to your taste)
1 teaspoon black pepper
1 teaspoon garlic powder (NOT garlic salt)
4 teaspoons cumin
4 tablespoons chili powder (again, adjust to your taste)
4 tablespoons flour
4 tablespoons corn meal
4 teaspoons lemon juice (see alternative ingredient at the end of the recipe)

Recipe:

Allow about 2½ hours to prepare.

Heat two tablespoons cooking oil in a skillet over medium heat. Add the chili meat and fry for 15 minutes. DO NOT STIR THE MEAT.

Turn the meat, without stirring, and cook for another 10 minutes.

While you are doing this put 6 cups of hot water in a 4 quart pot and dissolve the bullion cubes. When the beef is cooked break it up and add to this stock. Add the bay leaf. Add one additional cup of water. Be sure to use the grease that cooks off the meat in addition to the meat itself. Cook this for 1½ hours over low to medium heat (slow boil). You may cover the pot if you wish.

At about 1 hour and 20 minutes combine the following ingredients in a mixing bowl: Sugar, salt, red pepper, black pepper, garlic powder, cumin, chili powder.

Stir to mix well. When mixed stir it into the stock and leave at a slow boil for 10 minutes (leave the pot uncovered)

Mix the flour and the corn meal well. You do not want any lumps in this. Then add ¾ cup of water to form a watery paste. Once again stir well to eliminate any lumps. Then add this mix to the chili. This is the thickening agent.

Stir well and continue stirring for 5 minutes at a slow boil.

Cut the heat to below a simmer and add the lemon juice. In place of the lemon juice you may use 2 teaspoons of cider vinegar or 4 tablespoons of sherry if you like. Whatever you use, stir it in well.

Transcribers note:

I have successfully multiplied this recipe to make up to 10 gallons of chili at a time. The only alteration was that I often used less meat than would be called for with a straight multiplication of the ingredients.

While the recipe on the LP does not mention the rice or the way to mix the chili with it, here is my method based on experimentation and memory of how Shanghai Jimmy did it:

I always use Uncle Ben’s Converted Rice. It seems to divide into individual grains and stay firm. When I use this rice it is most like what I remember eating at Shanghai’s places.

As I recall he would add a pat of butter to the bottom of the Styrofoam cup and then add a layer of rice. Next he would add a layer of chili. This repeated at least two times. I never had mine with cheese, onions or celery so I am not sure when he added these ingredients. My thought is on top but I could be mistaken.

OK folks... I know that y'all have been waiting.

Here's Pedro Marsalis' Enchiladas with TexMex Chili Gravy

CHILI GRAVY
4 dried red New Mexico chiles (seeds removed, lightly toasted and ground in food processor)
1/2 cup Gebhardts chili powder
1 1/2 tsp ground cumin
1 medium yellow onion chopped fine
2 cloves garlic minced
1 tsp Mexican oregano
1 tsp salt
2 tablespoon of Mas Harina (or finely crushed tortilla chips)
3 tablespoon of flour
4 cups beef stock
1 pound lean ground beef
2 Tbs vegetable oil (or bacon drippings)

ENCHILADAS
Corn tortillas
1/4 yellow onion finely chopped
grated mixed cheddar and jack cheese
1/4 inch vegetable oil in small skillet

Chili Gravy
Crumble and brown beef in thick pot. Stir in chili powers, cumin, salt, garlic, and oregano.

In separate skillet heat oil and start to brown onions... when onions are starting to soften, sprinkle in flour... add a little more oil if it gets too dry. Cook for a minute and then slowly stir in one cup of broth... cook a little longer to thicken slightly. Add this mixture to beef with remainder of broth. Simmer for 50 minutes.

In a cup with the masa harina, stir in several spoons of liquid from beef... stir until smooth and no clumps. Add back to chili pot and cook an additional 10 minutes to thicken. (You will have enough for several meal or one hell of a big party.)

Enchiladas
Heat casserole dish in 375 oven. Remove dish and cover with a couple spoons of chili gravy.

Dip tortillas... one at a time in hot oil for about 10 seconds on each side. Roll around cheese and onions and place in dish. Lightly spoon additional chili gravy on the enchiladas and cover with remaining cheese and some onions.

Now place under hot broiler until heated through and cheese bubbles.

And as Porky Pig says, "That's All Folks!"

Peter, shoot! I did not see your thread. I must have not updated my page from earlier this a.m.. Maybe you or Teresa can combine them somehow?

Thanks Mike! That sounds like some good enchilada sauce.

And, thanks Sharon! We needed Homers great post here. Someone said that the recipe from Jimmy's LP is not the same as his recipe for the Chili Rice chili. I think this is true.

Clyde, from what many have said, there was for sure chopped celery. Someone said there was no extra charge for it. My speculation is that there may have been a few celery seeds in the chili. I stress "speculation"!
Joe

I do not remember the celery ether, Same prob as you Clyde. I will bet the farm that it was offered as an extra topping though. I have tried it and since I was told about it. Hey, not bad.

The thread at Roadfood.com has some good info about trying to track down the recipe. The cincy chili threads hold a clue to how Jummy made his chili I think. The oyster crackers Jimmy offered came from up north, as did Jimmy. The use of celery, celery salt, or celery seeds, also comes from the northern chili folks. Steak n Shake chili is an example of a non Cincy northern chili. I do not think it has celery though.

There was a Chili Rice place in Austin just a block or so from UT. It was like Jimmy's. I ate there allot. This was 1967 - 68 I think? Anyone rember thatplace.
Joe

Here's Pedro Marsalis' Enchiladas with TexMex Chili Gravy

Mike
Not to rain on your recipe, but shouldn't that be Miguel Marsalis?
Or is Pedro your alter ego? Like Spiderman?

This is in response to the post about Shanghai Jimmy's chili reciipe from the phonograph record. Basically I am repeating information that I believe I or another posted on the "original" Dallas Historical Society Message Board or on the roadfood.com board with perhaps one additional fact.

First, let me emphasize that I am not trying to be argumentative or impolite, but my memory of what was on the record (I used to have a copy but it was unfortunately lost when I moved from Dallas) and what I remember Jimmy saying was different.

I bought a copy of the record from Jimmy himself. I talked to him several times about his chili and he never admitted publishing - or recording - the recipe for the Chili Rice he sold to the public. I have a strong memory that on the copy of the record I owned that Jimmy described the recipe given as his "everyday" or "ordinary" chili and NOT as the chili we so relished on rice.

Altogether I ate Chili Rice in at least seven places and saw Jimmy and talked to him in five of them.

If Ms. Marsalis or Mr. Burks or another has a copy of the record please listen to it and advise whether or not it has one or both of those words, everyday or ordinary is in the message.

Also, thanks to Peterk for collecting and furnishing the SJ and Chili Rice internet references.

That the recipe looks pretty good I do not question, but I do not believe it to be the "real" reciipe.

Hi Bill, great to see you here!

I think most all agree that the recipe from the LP is not the recipe for Jimmy's Chili Rice chil. The BIG question is... how close can we come to Jimmy's real Chili Rice chili recipe? Jimmy was a one man show so this recipe had to be pretty fast and easy. I have treid lots of variations and I might be close. One problem I have is that it has been so long since I tasted Jimmy's chili.

Oh Bill, did Jimmy ever mention Jimmy's Kitchen to you? We have some new discussion about this, and the recipe, over at Roadfood.
Joe

The place I first heard of "Jimmy's Kitchen" was in his resume on the back of some of the menu sheets for Chili Rice that have been discussed. The second place was when I found a reference in a book. The third time was a collective thing you might say, when I found references by Googling or read the sesults of Google searches by others.

I can remember a little about SJs resume. He began by saying he would give a few dates and places and his occupation then because others might, with the prompts, remember a previous contact with him. Please remember, this was about 1956. WW 1 vets were still around in some numbers then and there were many, many WW 2 vets. Some of the things in the resuke were more or less as follows:

Jimmy said that he was in the Army during or just after WW1 and he mentioned serving in the American food relief effort that helped Russian refugees in the Far East. Dates of 1919 - 1930 were mentioned, best I remember. That relief effort was something I had heard of - Herbert Hoover was involved - although I have never tried to learn about it.

Jimmy gave the date he mustered out of the Army.

Jimmy said he operated an early radio station in China and gave the call letters which I don't remember. zhe said, in effect, that he picked the call letters and that you could use almost any call letter you wanted in that country at that time. I don't remember a date for that activity although I think 1923 was cited some where in the resume.

Jimmy said (again and still in the resume) he operated a restaurant named "Jimmy's Kitchen" and that it was "the place." He was talking about Shanghai. I don't remember the date but think it was given. There was no mention of any Hong Kong branch or another operation with the same name or a partnership with "Aaron Landau." I never asked Jimmy about "Jimmy's Kitchen" and don't remember him mentioning it.

I don't think there was any mention of the POW dinner. I believe I learned about that later from newspaper or magazine articles.

Jimmy said that he visited the USA after WW 2.

Jimmy said that with the communist take over in 1949 he lost everything and returned to this country permanently.

If and when some one posts a copy of the menu with resume it will be interesting to see how good my memory was.

IMO the ways to learn a littl more about SJ are to seek those who knew him and.or wrote about him. The sportswriter, Blackie Sherrod, mentioned him several times in Times Herald columns. The Sherrod columns are surely on microfilm in many libraries. I believe he had a daughter in Dallas and a brother in Tyler. Perhaps there are people who remember them, but it would surprise me if any of them read the Dallas History Board. There were a few people who posted on the "old" Dallas History Board who knew him and offered anecdotes. To find those people is going to require the same sort of sluething that writing a family history requires, or that private detectives do in locating a missing person. Jimmy was involved in a suburban ice skating rink business venture that failed and maybe others who were involved survive. Jimmy once told me that the "China Clipper" restaurant had good Chinese food. That place was located near North Dallas HS and had a distinctive neon airplane as part of the marque sign. Maybe the children of the people who operated that place can be located and maybe they have SJ stories.

I will enjoy any new information I read about Jimmy although I really discount the idea of anyone finding "the" recipe of the chili we enjoyed.

There is one final note, obvious I guess. that may not have been written down before on one of these message boards. Jimmy was from Minnesota. Jimmy was a good ice skater. No real surprise there!

Clyde,

Thank you for a post that is, as always succint and informative. You added tothe little Iknew about the relief efforts in the Far East and elsewhere. I would offer a couple of comments.

First, the errata in my note - the fist date should have read 1919 - 1921 and not 1930.

Second, believe that part of the legend about Jimmy is that he avoided internment as a foreign national by the Japanese after Pearl Harbor until after the POW dinner he gave. To me that is amazing but it seems to be the record in some of the articles that Peterk and others have researched about Jimmy.

Also, there were one or more Army units in North China before WW 2. One of them was a regiment descended from the 14th or 15th Ohio (if memory is correct) that fought well at Chickamauga. I think they were on the hill with General Thonas during the critical night. One of the monuments on the main road through the battlefield is to remember that unit, A book, The Old China Hands by Finney is an account of their time in China. They were withdrawn before WW# 2.

Please note. The army unit has nothing to do with Shanghai Jimmy or Chili Rice, or the "north China Marines" who were interred but the book is another window looking at American service life in China long ago. I used to have a copy of the book and wish I still did. It seems to be quite scarce now.

Again, thanks for the information.

Bill Crane

Here is the weird thing about Jimmy's Kitchem, it is stll going strong, with two locations. How can this be?
Joe

I just did a brief search on all my genealogy sources and found nothing so far---IF Shanghai Jimmy's real name was Jimmy James??? I am a little confused. Is he the same one as in this story:
"The prisoners also remembered the kindness of an American civilian, "Shanghai Jimmy" James, a Minnesotan who, at the outbreak of the war, owned four American-style restaurants in Shanghai that the Japanese somehow allowed to continue operating for some time. At Christmas 1942, Shanghai Jimmy provided a Christmas tree with trimmings, cigars, cigarettes and a hot turkey dinner for the Woosung prisoners, a tremendous boost to both health and morale. He continued to send food, medicine and other help to the prisoners until he, too, was interned in the prison camp."

Does anyone know his whole name? Did he die in Dallas? Or Houston? Does anyone know when or where he was buried?
Was he in both WWI and WWII ?

Sharon, thanks for your help! Tthe best info on Jimmy is at the old history site and at the Roadfood.com forum. That Wake Island thing is our Jimmy as far as I know.. He was in WW1 but not WW2. He owned restaurants during WW2.

I do not know when or where he died. I do know, from what I read, that his name was Jimmy James.
Joe

In the event anyone pursues Clyde Howard’s suggestion that Jimmy be traced through business records the following is what I remember about his career in Texas. I have to offer the disclaimers that I am almost seventy and that these events are things I heard about mostly between about 1956 and no later than 1986. I moved from Dallas in 1961. I or others have written most or all of this before but some of it was on the “old” Dallas History message board that is no longer easily viewed. All of the following are my personal experiences. I kept trying to find Chili Rice again when visiting after I moved.

• Jimmy left China permanently because of the communist revolution (1949) per the information on his resume. He evidently first operated a chili parlour or hot dog stand in Tyler. Later his brother took over this location or at least ran a similar operation in Tyler after Jimmy went to Dallas. According to “Archie” who is mentioned below. Jimmy’s brother DID NOT vend the same chili in Tyler that Jimmy sold in Dallas.

• Jimmy’s first location in Dallas was near the Ford Assembly plant. I was never there.

• Jimmy later operated a Chili Rice store in downtown Dallas, starting ca 1955, perhaps a little earlier. This was the place with the counters with holes in the table surfaces with garbage cans beneath and the old, old magazines. I remember Jimmy saying that type of a food operation needed a lot of walk by traffic who wanted lunch and that this location was better than his previous location. I also think that he mentioned having a daughter in Dallas.

NOTE & QUESTIONS: My memory was that this shop was on a diagonal street north of Elm. Did Live Oak continue south of Pacific to Elm years ago? Was there a “Mayflower Café” with distinctive sailing ship marquee in the apex of the triangle where the street intersected Elm? If not a Mayflower, what was the eatery located there?

• The first Chili Rice I ate was in a branch or franchise just west of SMU on the north side of McFarlin in space that I believe had earlier been operated as the Mustang Grill which probably offered sandwiches or hamburgers. It was up a few steps from the sidewalk. This location of Chili Rice was the first I visited and it was operated by “Archie” briefly from about 1955 (more likely 1956) to perhaps 1957. We were told “Archie” was taken ill when the shop closed, but maybe he just went broke. By that time I was also visiting the down town location mentioned above. Jimmy said that “Archie” was a master barber and could always go back to that when he was able to work again. Please note that this location was in a different jurisdiction, University Park, and I am sure would have had a different business license than the down town location.
• In the late 1950’s a Chili Rice stand operated seasonally at Fair Park during the State Fair and it served Jimmy’s chili. I never saw Jimmy there and I don’t know if the operators were franchise people or employees. It was an open air operation.

NOTE: Joe King has said that a form of chili and rice was sold at the Fair during 2007 at an indoor location but that it was not Jimmy’s.

• At some point Jimmy moved from down town to a location on or near Oak Lawn. He set up shop in what had been a fast food building of some kind. The building was very recognizable as having previously sold something else but I do not now remember what it was. I don’t have a date for the move.

• Jimmy was also involved in another business venture. He was an ice skater as has been mentioned on this message board and tried to establish a suburban ice rink. I don’t know where the business was located or if he was the sole proprietar, a partner, or what , but the business failed and I was told that Jimmy closed his Chili Rice stand and left Dallas for a time. I suppose there was still another license for the skating rink. Again, I don’t have a date.

• Jimmy also operated another Chili Rice near the airport. Of the several locations mentioned I remember this one least well and again I don’t have a date, but think it was after he returned to Dallas sometime after the failure of the ice skating rink. Again, I don’t have an address. I have to confess it is possible I have this location confused with the last one mentioned.

• Jimmy sold Chili Rice in a shared space at the west end of down town Dallas. Jimmy was no longer a young man at this point. It was close to the “old Spaghetti Warehouse” or “Old Spaghetti Factory” north of the streets that merge into the triple underpass. It might have been on Market or even Lamar. It was in a soup and sandwich shop operated by a woman younger than Jimmy. She might have been German. One of her soups was potatoe soup. I had the idea that she kind of looked after Jimmy but I might be completely wrong.
NOTE: It was in this place that I one day saw Jimmy very industriously and very skillfully slicing / chopping oranges to make marmalade which is why I once said I thought he was probably a good working cook. I also believe I purchased the “Texas Chili” LP from him at that location. Also, I once heard him say that Clint Murchison sometimes arranged to get a batch of his chili and I think that was in this location.

• Jimmy later sold Chili Rice in another shared space on Knox west of Central. There used to be an ice cream store on the same side of the street as Highland Park Cafeteria near the RR tracks. Was that Ashburn’s, Mashburn’s, Washburn’s or ??? They made ice cream there and sold it by the cone, or in pint or in larger containers. It was in this location that I had a vegetarian version of Chili Rice made with black eye peas which Jimmy said he had decided on after some experimentation. I don’t think he sold a meat version at all there. The seasoning was much the same as I remember. I have to tell you that store had a funny smell with the heavy cream smell from the dairy work combined with chili seasoning spices! This was the last place I saw Jimmy.

NOTE: I am not sure whether this location is in Dallas or Highland Park so I guess that anyone trying to find business licenses might have to check another place. Also, I know nothing of the people who operated the ice cream store. This has just occurred to me. Was it possible that the store owners were observant Jews and that Jimmy sold a vegetarian chili there to avoid any real or apparent conflict with the dietary laws? The only Ashburn’s I knew in Dallas were Baptist and I don’t think connected to that business.

SPECIAL NOTE: Anyone experimenting with vegetarian chili could do worse than to use black eye peas!

• The last Chili Rice place I remember was in another shared space north of Bachman’s Lake, across NW High Way and I can’t remember if it was east or west of the picnic pavilion or what the main business in the building was. I never saw Jimmy there and probably ate there fewer times than at any other location.

This has been a long post for anyone still reading. I myself am satisfied that he was “Jimmy James,” but certainly hope to someday see the above verified and dated by research of business records or directories and the like. It is also possible I have missed a location. I think that the research will have to be done by current Dallasites.

Bill Crane

This is to thank Ms. Marsalis for doing the family history number on Shanghai Jimmy. The only thing I can add is that I suspect that Jimmy died in Dallas or that his death was reported in the Dallas newspapers.

And am I wrong in thinking that there are death records available on some of the internet family history web sites?

I recall the closing that "BEVO 1200" used to make on the old Dallas History Board and perhaps I can be forgiven for borrowing it here.

"Thanks to all for all."

Bill Crane

I have looked at the WWI registration cards and the only one for a James, born in Minnesota was for a "Blind Student".
There are early Minnesota territory census records (late 1800s into early 1900s) and I have found 'George" James listed but so far no Jimmy or James James but will keep looking.
There were several George James in Tyler and many Jimmy James all over the country. That is the problem without definite birth dates etc.
So far no Death Record of Jimmy James--fitting the estimated birth date range--has been found in Dallas but there was one in Houston.
Of course he could have been listed by a formal first name that was used legally. Altrnate spellings also have to be considered.

Of course Census records end at at 1930 so, most likely, he will be found only on pre WWI ones--especially if he was the Shanghai Jimmy of the WWII story.

Finally I don't see how any of this will bring you the chili recipes but the verification of him as a person who led a very unusual life will be confirmed---or sadly maybe not.

I do not live in Dallas but will check all the online resources I can access.
Sharon
(Incidentally Mike worked for Ashburns on Lovers Lane and filled in at the Knox Street location as a teen during the years 1961-63. He says the Knox Street was their actual manufacturing and retail plant. As best he remembers 2 brothers were the owners. Regardless-- in that time frame he says no chili or anything other than ice cream was served.)

Lots of good info Bill!

Anyone interested in reading the thread at the dallashistory.org site can get to iy by doing a Google for;

"shanghai jimmy" dallashistory.org

A link will come up on the first page, along with the thread on Roadfood.
Joe

and if you want to restrict the search to just dallashistory.org copy and paste the following into google

"shanghai jimmy" site:dallashistory.org

On the old site I found a Nove4, 2004 post by Patrick Spreng very interesting:

Jimmy's cart had the chili, rice and other ingredients (grated cheddar cheese, chopped onions, chopped celery, chili powder, etc.) in separate bins, and he built each order on the spot. I used to order a double-hot -- two layers each of rice and chili -- with cheese and chili powder. He served it unmixed, leaving that task to the customer.

I've had good results with my own Texas chili -- based on Wick Fowler's 2-Alarm Chili Kit -- and long-grained white rice.

Regards,
Patrick

I have read tons of posts and each seems to say that the chili was simple and already prepared or ready to be presented---did any one remember seeing him actually make the chili itself? Does anyone remember if the chili was a ground beef type or a "chopped" beef type?